mm <***@bigfoot.com> wrote:
: On Thu, 2 Oct 2014 00:50:05 +0000 (UTC), Harry Weiss <***@panix.com>
: >cindys <***@rochester.rr.com> wrote:
: >> On Tuesday, September 30, 2014 1:20:04 PM UTC-4, ***@btinternet.com wrote:
: >> > On Tuesday, September 30, 2014 3:32:48 PM UTC+1, henry.dot.goodman.at.virgin.net wrote:
: >> >
: >> > > I have never lived in a country that has separation of Church and State but I think that
: >> >
: >> > > if that means making it difficult for Jewish children (or adults, or other religions) to
: >> >
: >> > > observe their religious requirements then it is a bad idea.
: >> >
: >> > The British system works well. You can send your children to a Jewish state school which
: >> >
: >> > almost always also offers an excellent standard of secular education. Unfortunately it's
: >> >
: >> > under threat because of the evolution issue, rules designed to prevent Christian
: >> >
: >> > fundamentalists from teaching creationism have caught Jewish schools which wish not
: >> >
: >> > to teach evolution (there's an important difference).
: >> -----
: >> Over the course of the years you have been posting here, every time the topic is church/state separation issues vis-a-vis Jewish schools, you keep telling us that the main issue for Jewish schools is or could be that they would have to teach evolution and not be allowed to teach creationism (or something like that). Again, as I know I have personally explained to you in the past, evolution versus creationism is a truly insignificant part of a Jewish day school curriculum.
: >> The Jewish day school curriculum revolves around prayers, learning about Jewish holidays and Jewish law, learning about Sabbath observance, keeping kosher, learning to read Hebrew, studying chumash, mishna, midrash, and talmud. A Jewish school is NOT a Christian school where (perhaps, since I know very little about Christian schools), the religious aspect is a focus on "bible study." That is NOT what a Jewish school is about at all, and nobody seems to be obsessing about this evolution/creation thing except you. In fact, my son learned all about evolution *in a black hat yeshiva* as part of the New York State Regents Life Science curriculum. So, there you go...
: >> So, please stop saying that the big deal with church-state separation would be that Jewish day school students would have to learn about evolution and not creation. The issue is insignificant (not to mention that outside the black hat world, most Jews believe that evolution is a fact that can be reconciled with creation anyway).
: >> Best regards,
: >> ---Cindy S.
: >You are correct both in my experience with myself and my children, (There
: >are some Yeshivot that have little or no secular subjects, but that is a
: >separate issue)
: >Secular clasees were independant, Usually when evolution is tought, one of
: >the students will ask their Morning (Judiaca) teachers about who will
: >discuss his view,
: There are so many things to teach, I don't know why evolution has to be
: taught one way or the other in public schools, and certainly not
: creationism which is an inherently religious notion.
: I went to public school through high school and they never said a word
: about evolution. They also never got past the Civil War in American
: History class. Some things people have to learn outside of school.
: >The one things that is not tought in many Yehivot is sex ed.
: I think it was the 8th grade, 1957, that there was a boys movie for the
: boys and and a girls movie for the girls in the gymnasium, at different
: times of course. The only thing I remember from the boys movie is that
: if you ask a girl to go to the beach and she says no, don't assume she
: doesn't like you. But we had no beach in Indianapolis.
I am probably older than many in this group and I learned is simple ways
about evolution as early as third grade when we made big murals for the
school corridors each reresenting a different epoch in the development
of life on earth. A big sea one with all kinds of early shellfish and a
big giant repptile one full of dinasaurs anb big trees, etc and so on. We
also studied it in High School biology and some schools offered Earth
Science as a 9th grade subject. I didn't take that one.
As to Americah History, that was what I taught and we covered up to the
Civil War in the firt term of a two term course. what we had trouble
getting to at that time, was past WWII and the start of the Cold War. I
have been out of the field many years so I imagne they now do get into mor
post-war historyas it ic some 70 yearss tht we wold hate to have to
not cover. I never herd f a American History course in our time that only
got as far as the Civil War in the standard curriculum .