Discussion:
excessive salaries to executives of Jewish charities
(too old to reply)
w***@interchange.ubc.ca
2004-12-09 14:08:04 UTC
Permalink
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20

This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.

In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Of particular interest are the following:

Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
Rabbi Marvin Hier, Simon Wiesenthal Center
Abraham Foxman, ADL

These individuals receive far more in compensation than anyone I have
ever worked with in my life, more than anyone I have ever known (I
believe). I do not feel comfortable in making contributions to these
groups when I know that my contributions help to subsidize a standard
of living that is far higher than that of the middle class people who
make up my own world of friends and family. Yes, of course there are
wealthy donors to whom these excessive salaries may seem moderate. But
to most people, to most of those who are asked to contribute, these
salaries place these functionaries in a realm of luxury that ordinary
people can only dream of.

The mainline Catholic and Protestant agencies do not pay such salaries.
Why do the Jewish groups ?

This is not a new problem, but, as far as I know, it has not received
the attention it deserves.
ben
2004-12-09 15:24:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
Here are some other good charity checking sites:

This one rates each charity based on various criteria and shows how much of
your dollar actually goes to the cause and how much towards other expenses:
( http://tinyurl.com/3jhat )
http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.results&keyword_list=jewish&Submit.x=0&Submit.y=0&Submit=Submit

Also:
http://www.give.org/reports/index.asp

regards,
Binyomin
--
"What passes for wisdom may only be eloquent foolishness"

Cheap long distance calling using Onesuite (http://www.onesuite.com).
2.5 c/min within the U.S. or to Canada. 3.5 c/min to Israel. No monthly
or connection fees! Use promotional code 04AQ48345 for 20 free minutes.
Jeffrey Smith
2004-12-09 17:30:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
Rabbi Marvin Hier, Simon Wiesenthal Center
Abraham Foxman, ADL
These individuals receive far more in compensation than anyone I have
ever worked with in my life, more than anyone I have ever known (I
believe). I do not feel comfortable in making contributions to these
groups when I know that my contributions help to subsidize a standard
of living that is far higher than that of the middle class people who
make up my own world of friends and family. Yes, of course there are
wealthy donors to whom these excessive salaries may seem moderate. But
to most people, to most of those who are asked to contribute, these
salaries place these functionaries in a realm of luxury that ordinary
people can only dream of.
The mainline Catholic and Protestant agencies do not pay such salaries.
Why do the Jewish groups ?
This is not a new problem, but, as far as I know, it has not received
the attention it deserves.
We have a situation in London, where the United Synagogue are spending so
much money on very-highly paid administration staff, that they can no longer
afford to pay for some shuls to have both a chazzan and a rabbi.
--
Jeffrey Smith
Fiona
2004-12-09 17:55:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
Rabbi Marvin Hier, Simon Wiesenthal Center
Abraham Foxman, ADL
R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (£261,000 in real money),
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they head.
Executive salaries for non-profit organisations have to be competative with
profit making organisations of comparable size and complexity if the NPOs
are to attract top calibre staff. You cannot expect people to risk the same
levels of stress and responsibility as commercial companies but for less
just because it's an NPO.

As for Solender, I'm not sure how to interpret the figures, over a million
may be excessive, but more than half of that is pension provision.
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
The mainline Catholic and Protestant agencies do not pay such salaries.
Why do the Jewish groups ?
What does it matter to us what the Xtians pay their staff?
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
This is not a new problem, but, as far as I know, it has not received
the attention it deserves.
Why is it a problem?


Fiona
Nick
2004-12-10 02:30:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fiona
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
Rabbi Marvin Hier, Simon Wiesenthal Center
Abraham Foxman, ADL
R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (£261,000 in real money),
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they head.
Executive salaries for non-profit organisations have to be competative with
profit making organisations of comparable size and complexity if the NPOs
are to attract top calibre staff. You cannot expect people to risk the same
levels of stress and responsibility as commercial companies but for less
just because it's an NPO.
As for Solender, I'm not sure how to interpret the figures, over a million
may be excessive, but more than half of that is pension provision.
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
The mainline Catholic and Protestant agencies do not pay such salaries.
Why do the Jewish groups ?
What does it matter to us what the Xtians pay their staff?
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
This is not a new problem, but, as far as I know, it has not received
the attention it deserves.
Why is it a problem?
Fiona
I thought that was the whole point - that it was a charity, a non-profit
organization. You might have to pay some attention to the market but you
might want people who are committed to the objectives of the charity.

If they are in it solely for the money then they should go and work for a
corporation.

As for comparisons with non-Jewish organisations in the UK and I presume in
the US Jewish organisations employ non-Jewish staff except at perhaps at the
highest levels so it is relevant to compare the pay with other charities of
a similar size whatever their denomination or purpose.

I don't know what the problem is comparing with non-Jewish organisations -
well, I do actually - it confirms the stereotype of the Jew.

Anyway we can vote with our feet by giving to charities where less is spent
on administration etc.

Nick
Eliyahu Rooff
2004-12-10 04:56:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
This is not a new problem, but, as far as I know, it has not received
the attention it deserves.
Why is it a problem?
Fiona
I thought that was the whole point - that it was a charity, a
non-profit
organization. You might have to pay some attention to the market but you
might want people who are committed to the objectives of the charity.
If they are in it solely for the money then they should go and work for a
corporation.
Part of the problem is one of PR. People become reluctant to donate to
charities if they feel that their contributions are just going to enrich
the top staff members. Many of us donors who are in the low five-figure
income range are likely to feel that it won't make a difference whether
we give or not, considering how many such donors are needed just to pay
the CEO's annual salary.

Eliyahu
Fiona
2004-12-10 08:35:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Eliyahu Rooff
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
This is not a new problem, but, as far as I know, it has not
received the attention it deserves.
Why is it a problem?
I thought that was the whole point - that it was a charity, a non-profit
organization. You might have to pay some attention to the market but you
might want people who are committed to the objectives of the charity.
If they are in it solely for the money then they should go and work
for a corporation.
Part of the problem is one of PR. People become reluctant to donate to
charities if they feel that their contributions are just going to enrich
the top staff members. Many of us donors who are in the low five-figure
income range are likely to feel that it won't make a difference whether
we give or not, considering how many such donors are needed just to pay
the CEO's annual salary.
Part of the problem is that punters don't understand that once a charity
reaches critical mass it earns more from investments that it does from
donations, those investments have to be managed properly just like in any
other financial institution, and that management has to be paid for. Employ
someone who can't hack it in the commercial market and you're on a loser.


Fiona
Abe Kouris
2004-12-10 16:51:04 UTC
Permalink
Several problems with the line of reasoning that says that leaders of
charities need to be paid like leaders of commerical concerns:

1) Hands-on management of investsments is done by specialized staff,
not by the person with the top title. Perhaps these staff need to be
paid the going rate to ensure quality, but overpaying top executives
sends the wrong message to potential supporters.

2) Contributions are still important to charities, at least to
legitiamte charities that want to keep some connection to the
communities they serve. (Even with a large endowment, my college
solicits donations, even $5 donations from recent grads, larger
contributors do loook at percentage of support by alumni.) And sending
the wrong message to the community they serve doesn't help with
contributors.

3) The real problem is not just that top execs in the charities are
making too much, it's that top execs in commercial companies are making
too much. This may be more a USA issue, as I've read that CEO's and
other top execs in Europe don't make the kinds of obscene salaries
that USA executives pay themselves.

4) Most top management folks aren't wortth the salary that they get
paid. This assertion comes from close observation over 25 years.

5) Christiann and secular charities manage to find talented top
management that can work for less, why can't Jewish groups do the same
thing? I'm sure there are lots of smart, talented idealistic Jewish
managers out there who have other concerns about their job than how
much money they will earn.
Fiona
2004-12-10 08:30:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
Rabbi Marvin Hier, Simon Wiesenthal Center
Abraham Foxman, ADL
R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (£261,000 in real money),
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they head.
Executive salaries for non-profit organisations have to be competative
with
Post by Fiona
profit making organisations of comparable size and complexity if the NPOs
are to attract top calibre staff. You cannot expect people to risk the
same
Post by Fiona
levels of stress and responsibility as commercial companies but for less
just because it's an NPO.
As for Solender, I'm not sure how to interpret the figures, over a million
may be excessive, but more than half of that is pension provision.
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
The mainline Catholic and Protestant agencies do not pay such salaries.
Why do the Jewish groups ?
What does it matter to us what the Xtians pay their staff?
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
This is not a new problem, but, as far as I know, it has not received
the attention it deserves.
Why is it a problem?
I thought that was the whole point - that it was a charity, a non-profit
organization. You might have to pay some attention to the market but you
might want people who are committed to the objectives of the charity.
If they are in it solely for the money then they should go and work for a
corporation.
Where is your proof that they are in it solely for the money? Perhaps they
give 50% of their salaries back to the charities. You don't know, you are
working purely on assumptions (as usual). Sure let them go and work in
commerce, and let the charities be run into the ground by incompetents. You
get what you pay for.

If you were to look into it, you would find that all staff working for
charities, from bottom to top are paid a market rate, so why pick on only
the CEO? Why not demand that everyone in organisation work at 10% less than
the market rate including those a the bottom working on the minimum wage,
surely they too have a duty (in your worldview) to give 10% to the charity?

The real problem is that people don't follow the mitzvah to judge people
equally regardless of their wealth.


Fiona
Abe Kouris
2004-12-10 16:51:23 UTC
Permalink
"The miztvah to judge people equally rgardless of their wealth?"

First time I ever heard of that one.

I don't judge rich people becuase they have wealth, I judge them on
what they do to obtain and keep their wealth, and what they might do
with the wealth.

In othwer words, great wealth is not a gift bestowed by God as proof of
one's worthiness (the American Protestant/Calvinist view), but rather
God gives great wealth to a person as a test to see what that person
will do with it,

And, in my experience, most wealthy people fail the test miserably.
Heck, even most middle-class people fail the test.

Abe
Nick
2004-12-12 18:11:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Abe Kouris
"The miztvah to judge people equally rgardless of their wealth?"
First time I ever heard of that one.
I don't judge rich people becuase they have wealth, I judge them on
what they do to obtain and keep their wealth, and what they might do
with the wealth.
In othwer words, great wealth is not a gift bestowed by God as proof of
one's worthiness (the American Protestant/Calvinist view), but rather
God gives great wealth to a person as a test to see what that person
will do with it,
And, in my experience, most wealthy people fail the test miserably.
Heck, even most middle-class people fail the test.
Abe
The United Synagogue that I grew up in in London, did in fact worship
wealth. I am glad that it has changed. Certainly the fixers are self-made
wealthy rather than inherited wealthy. See the Cousinhood by Chaim Bermant.
The present Chief Rabbi, Jonathan Sacks, was anointed by Sir Stanley Kalms
(see Kalms Report, if I remember) who owns the largest electrical chain in
the country.

More recently he lost faith in Jonathan Sacks and he obviously thought that
he should resign at his behest.

50 years ago the President of the US (UK) was Sir (Bernard) Waley-Cohen who
went hunting and was one of the founders of Shell Oil.

Fortunately nowadays it is more meritocratic and it is run by religious
people.

Nick
Nick
2004-12-12 18:12:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Abe Kouris
"The miztvah to judge people equally rgardless of their wealth?"
First time I ever heard of that one.
I don't judge rich people becuase they have wealth, I judge them on
what they do to obtain and keep their wealth, and what they might do
with the wealth.
In othwer words, great wealth is not a gift bestowed by God as proof of
one's worthiness (the American Protestant/Calvinist view), but rather
God gives great wealth to a person as a test to see what that person
will do with it,
And, in my experience, most wealthy people fail the test miserably.
Heck, even most middle-class people fail the test.
Abe
See http://www.jlaw.com/Articles/againstosten.html

The Simple Life: The Case Against Ostentation in Jewish Law by Hershey H.
Friedman, Professor of Business and Marketing at City U, NY.

Nick

No Terms of Reference
Nick
2004-12-13 15:12:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Abe Kouris
"The miztvah to judge people equally rgardless of their wealth?"
First time I ever heard of that one.
I don't judge rich people becuase they have wealth, I judge them on
what they do to obtain and keep their wealth, and what they might do
with the wealth.
In othwer words, great wealth is not a gift bestowed by God as proof of
one's worthiness (the American Protestant/Calvinist view), but rather
God gives great wealth to a person as a test to see what that person
will do with it,
And, in my experience, most wealthy people fail the test miserably.
Heck, even most middle-class people fail the test.
Abe
Wind-up I think a quote from the NT That it is easier to get a camel through
the eye of a needle than it is a richman to get into heaven.

According to my father, the "needle" is a mistranslation and that the
"needle" is, in fact a gate.

Nick
Micha Berger
2004-12-16 16:39:09 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 15:12:59 +0000 (UTC), Nick <tulse04-***@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
: Wind-up I think a quote from the NT That it is easier to get a camel through
: the eye of a needle than it is a richman to get into heaven.

It's based on a talmudic quote, a promise G-d makes the repentent: If
you make for yourself an opening like the eye of a needle, I will make
it into a doorway like the entrance to the Temple Portico.

This is a useful metaphor, as first the doorway was huge, roughly 30x60
ft (20x40 amos), and second because it suggests that G-d gives us the
means, but awaits for us to actually step through the portico (ulam)
to the holies and holy of holies within.

See also Eiruvin 53b, which speaks of the hearts of the earlies sages
being like the doorway of the portico, but the later ones being as broad
as the doorway of the heichal ("only" 10x20 amos). It's a true "dwarves
atop giants" type metaphor -- the later sages are further within, but
their hearts are smaller.

Mahadura Basra at lock links this to an enigmatic gemara on
Eiruvin 21a about the size of the Torah. For more info, see
<http://dafyomi.shemayisrael.co.il/eruvin/insites/ev-dt-021.htm>.

The line about the sinner having no hope is in the Qur'an 7:40: "The
impious shall find the gates of heaven shut, nor shall he enter till a
camel pass through the eye of a needle."

The difference is in line with Islam's stress on Divine Justice to the
exclusion of Divine Mercy.

Yeishu's comment, OTOH, reflects their belief that man can't redeem
himself but must rely on extenral salvation. Playing down divine justice
and only speaking of their god's mercy. (I don't capitalize for the
trinitarian god, unlike Islam's true monotheism.)

We, OTOH, believe in a definition of Good that is tif'eres, harmony,
between the two. We recognize a human condition that is a set of
dialectics, we must balance law and love, justice and mercy, truth
and peace (think about tact). We therefore see G-d's actions through
two conflicting lenses. As Rashi quotes chazal in his commentary on
the begining of Bereishis: the Torah uses the tetragrammaton when
His actions look to us as those of mercy, and the name E-lokim
(c.f. A-llah) when they appear harsh and the imposition of law.

The following is from Hamaayan by Reb Shlomo Katz, serves off torah.org:
: In the Friday night zemirot composed by the Arizal we read: "To the right
: and to the left, and in between them, the bride." The "bride" presumably is
: Shabbat, but what is "to the right and to the left"?

: Rav Pinchus David Horowitz z"l (the "Bostoner Rebbe") explains:

: In kabbalah, the "right" and the "left" represent the attributes of "chessed"
: (loving-kindness) and "gevurah" (strength) respectively. In our history,
: Avraham epitomized chessed (the right) and Yitzchak, gevurah (the left).

: Avraham fathered Yishmael, who, according to the midrash, refused to accept
: the Torah because it outlawed adultery. Adultery is the result of chessed
: (love) gone awry (see Vayikra 20:17). Yitzchak fathered Esav, who refused to
: accept the Torah because it prohibited murder, which is the excessive use of
: "gevurah."

: The nations on the right and the left observe their sabbaths to the right
: and the left of Shabbat, i.e., on Friday and Sunday, respectively. It is to
: this that the Arizal's song refers.

: Each of these three nations--Yishmael, Esav, and ourselves-- claims to have
: the true Torah of Avraham. When we observe Shabbat, says the Bostoner Rebbe,
: we add to it a few minutes from Friday and a few minutes from Sunday in
: order to solidify our claim. (quoted in Shoshelet Boston p.273)

Back to Nick's post:
: According to my father, the "needle" is a mistranslation and that the
: "needle" is, in fact a gate.

Given the ubiquity of the metaphor in other languages, I am not sure your
father is correct. Some Christian scholars suggest that "the eye of the
needle" is a proper translation, but an idiom for the small gate in the
great gate in the wall around the city. Perhaps that's what your father
was speaking about? However, there is no indication from contemporary
sources that such an idiom was actually in use.

-mi
--
Micha Berger I slept and dreamt that life was joy.
***@aishdas.org I awoke and found that life was duty.
http://www.aishdas.org I worked and, behold -- duty is joy.
Fax: (270) 514-1507 - Rabindranath Tagore
Yisroel Markov
2004-12-16 18:15:44 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 16:39:09 +0000 (UTC), Micha Berger
<***@aishdas.org> said:

[snip]
Post by Micha Berger
Mahadura Basra at lock
Ad loc?
BTW, who is Mahadura Basra (lit. First Edition)?

[snip]
Post by Micha Berger
We, OTOH, believe in a definition of Good that is tif'eres, harmony,
between the two. We recognize a human condition that is a set of
dialectics, we must balance law and love, justice and mercy, truth
and peace (think about tact). We therefore see G-d's actions through
two conflicting lenses. As Rashi quotes chazal in his commentary on
the begining of Bereishis: the Torah uses the tetragrammaton when
His actions look to us as those of mercy, and the name E-lokim
(c.f. A-llah) when they appear harsh and the imposition of law.
The kabbalists also made a lot of the fact that sometimes these are
reversed, as in "And Hashem rained fire upon Sodom."

[snip]

Yisroel "Godwrestler Warriorson" Markov - Boston, MA Member
www.reason.com -- for unbiased analysis of the world DNRC
--------------------------------------------------------------------
"Judge, and be prepared to be judged" -- Ayn Rand
Micha Berger
2004-12-16 19:46:20 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 18:15:44 +0000 (UTC), Yisroel Markov <***@iname.com> wrote:
: <***@aishdas.org> said:
: [snip]
:>Mahadura Basra at lock

: Ad loc?

Yes. That's an oddball, even for me.

: BTW, who is Mahadura Basra (lit. First Edition)?

"Basar" is after or end, it would be more like "late edition".

(Bava Qama - first gate; Bava Metzi'ah - middle gate; Bava Basra -
last gate. The three sections of what was originally a single Tractate
Neziqin.)

He was the Maharshah's son-in-law. The link that I offered to a page from
the Daf Yomi Advancement Forum discusses the position of the Maharshah,
and gives the Mahadura Basra's extension of his FIL's position.

-mi
--
Micha Berger A person must be very patient
***@aishdas.org even with himself.
http://www.aishdas.org - attributed to R' Nachman of Breslov
Fax: (270) 514-1507
Yisroel Markov
2004-12-10 18:58:53 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 08:30:49 +0000 (UTC), "Fiona"
[snip]
Post by Fiona
Post by Nick
I thought that was the whole point - that it was a charity, a non-profit
organization. You might have to pay some attention to the market but you
might want people who are committed to the objectives of the charity.
If they are in it solely for the money then they should go and work for a
corporation.
Where is your proof that they are in it solely for the money? Perhaps they
give 50% of their salaries back to the charities.
That'd be *very* tax-inefficient.
Post by Fiona
You don't know, you are
working purely on assumptions (as usual). Sure let them go and work in
commerce, and let the charities be run into the ground by incompetents. You
get what you pay for.
To a large extent, yes. But AFAIK in USA most charities that employ
professional staffs do pay less than market rates to the top
management, with a few exceptions. That's because the nature of the
job is supposed to be its own additional reward.
Post by Fiona
If you were to look into it, you would find that all staff working for
charities, from bottom to top are paid a market rate, so why pick on only
the CEO? Why not demand that everyone in organisation work at 10% less than
the market rate including those a the bottom working on the minimum wage,
surely they too have a duty (in your worldview) to give 10% to the charity?
The real problem is that people don't follow the mitzvah to judge people
equally regardless of their wealth.
Good point.

Yisroel "Godwrestler Warriorson" Markov - Boston, MA Member
www.reason.com -- for unbiased analysis of the world DNRC
--------------------------------------------------------------------
"Judge, and be prepared to be judged" -- Ayn Rand
Nick
2004-12-16 23:14:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Yisroel Markov
On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 08:30:49 +0000 (UTC), "Fiona"
[snip]
Post by Fiona
Post by Nick
I thought that was the whole point - that it was a charity, a non-profit
organization. You might have to pay some attention to the market but you
might want people who are committed to the objectives of the charity.
If they are in it solely for the money then they should go and work for a
corporation.
Where is your proof that they are in it solely for the money? Perhaps they
give 50% of their salaries back to the charities.
That'd be *very* tax-inefficient.
Post by Fiona
You don't know, you are
working purely on assumptions (as usual). Sure let them go and work in
commerce, and let the charities be run into the ground by incompetents. You
get what you pay for.
To a large extent, yes. But AFAIK in USA most charities that employ
professional staffs do pay less than market rates to the top
management, with a few exceptions. That's because the nature of the
job is supposed to be its own additional reward.
Post by Fiona
If you were to look into it, you would find that all staff working for
charities, from bottom to top are paid a market rate, so why pick on only
the CEO? Why not demand that everyone in organisation work at 10% less than
the market rate including those a the bottom working on the minimum wage,
surely they too have a duty (in your worldview) to give 10% to the charity?
The real problem is that people don't follow the mitzvah to judge people
equally regardless of their wealth.
Good point.
That may be, but someone who is interested solely in material wealth should
not be working for a charity - it is a contradiction in terms.

I know a lot about the charity sector, and whilst people must have good
conditions of service but I don't think that people give to charities in
order to enrich excessively the Chief Executive.

If someone wants to go into a career business and in which there is a high
degree of risk.

The idea of ordinary people giving of their hard earned income in the form
of charity in order to make the senior executives of a charity wealthy
beyond their own wildest dreams, seems to my mind, unsustainable.

Nick
Eliyahu Rooff
2004-12-17 00:07:05 UTC
Permalink
"Nick" <tulse04-***@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:cpt32c$nvo$***@hercules.btinternet.com...
| | >
|
| That may be, but someone who is interested solely in material
wealth should
| not be working for a charity - it is a contradiction in terms.
|
| I know a lot about the charity sector, and whilst people must have
good
| conditions of service but I don't think that people give to
charities in
| order to enrich excessively the Chief Executive.
|
That's a problem that many of us see, especially when needy
potential recipients get turned away because of "limited resources."
A salary of, for instance, a million dollars a year takes away the
ability to fully sustain 50 families well above the poverty line or
to give additional financial help to a couple hundred who are just
below the poverty line which would make the difference between
subsistance-living and living halfway comfortably. I'm not giving
to make one person rich; I'm giving to help the poor.

Eliyahu

Nick
2004-12-11 23:13:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fiona
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy.
I
Post by Fiona
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
Rabbi Marvin Hier, Simon Wiesenthal Center
Abraham Foxman, ADL
R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (£261,000 in real
money),
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they
head.
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
Executive salaries for non-profit organisations have to be competative
with
Post by Fiona
profit making organisations of comparable size and complexity if the
NPOs
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
are to attract top calibre staff. You cannot expect people to risk the
same
Post by Fiona
levels of stress and responsibility as commercial companies but for less
just because it's an NPO.
As for Solender, I'm not sure how to interpret the figures, over a
million
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
may be excessive, but more than half of that is pension provision.
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
The mainline Catholic and Protestant agencies do not pay such
salaries.
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
Why do the Jewish groups ?
What does it matter to us what the Xtians pay their staff?
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
This is not a new problem, but, as far as I know, it has not received
the attention it deserves.
Why is it a problem?
I thought that was the whole point - that it was a charity, a non-profit
organization. You might have to pay some attention to the market but you
might want people who are committed to the objectives of the charity.
If they are in it solely for the money then they should go and work for a
corporation.
Where is your proof that they are in it solely for the money? Perhaps they
give 50% of their salaries back to the charities. You don't know, you are
working purely on assumptions (as usual). Sure let them go and work in
commerce, and let the charities be run into the ground by incompetents. You
get what you pay for.
If you were to look into it, you would find that all staff working for
charities, from bottom to top are paid a market rate, so why pick on only
the CEO? Why not demand that everyone in organisation work at 10% less than
the market rate including those a the bottom working on the minimum wage,
surely they too have a duty (in your worldview) to give 10% to the charity?
The real problem is that people don't follow the mitzvah to judge people
equally regardless of their wealth.
Fiona
The discussion was about the pay for jobs in charities. I don't know about
the US but I do know about the UK. It is quite clear that one has to make a
considerable sacrifice to work for a charity.

In the CharityJOB Weekly Digest that I receive weekly (see below) none of
the jobs advertised is at more than £40,000.

It is also apparent that the Fundraising Managers are amongst the more
highly paid.

It rather depends what jobs one is talking about. If it a large Jewish
social service charity, which has a Director of Social Services that
organisation does need to compare with a similar person working for a local
authority social services with the same budget. It does depend on what is
the market that the person is being recruited in.

I appreciate Chief Executive and senior positions will be advertised
separately.

I also look in the Jewish Chronicle each week to see what jobs are being
advertised in communal organisations.

Below is the list of jobs advertised in CharityJOB this week and their rates
of pay in this edition:


Administration Manager (interim), The Principle Partnership - Human Rights
NGO, London N1, £25,000-28,000
Administrative Assistant, The Stuart Low Trust, N1-Islington, £17,750 p.a.
pro-rata
Administrator (part-time), Medair, London SW1, Not Specified
Assistant to Directors, Apex Leicester Project Ltd, Leicester, According to
qualifications/experience
Events Co-ordinator/Office Assistant, ACPP, London SE1, c£18,000-£20,000
Health & Safety Officer, Charity Action Recruitment, North London,
£18,000-21,000
PA to Director HH/JL/4007, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT - HOUSING,
Wembley HA9, £10.00 p/hr
Parentalk Administrator, PARENTALK, London SE1, 16,000 pro rata
Part Time Receptionist, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT - CHILDREN, West
Drayton UB7, £7.50 p/hr
Payroll Administrator, Eden Brown, London - City, £7.50 - 8.00 per hour
Project Administrator £20-21k City, Synergy Group, City of London, £20000 -
£21000 per annum + £20-21k
Receptionist, The Principle Partnership, professional membership body,
London EC1, £19000 - £20000
Regional Project Manager - West Midlands Home Based, EDEN BROWN - (Agy)
Charity, West Midlands - Home Based, £20,000
Senior Administrator / Office Manager, Synergy Group, South East London,
£12 - £13 per hour
Senior Database Marketing Assistant, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London,
£21,900
Temporary Resource Assistant, Adept Recruitment, London SE1, £20,000 pro
rata

ADVICE/INFORMATION
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=2

Advice Case Worker, Welsh Refugee Council, Swansea, £17,500 p.a.
Content Officer, Charity Action Recruitment, London, SE1, £20,000 +
Contract Manager (Gateshead), Health Organisation, Gateshead, £25,290 -
£33,032
Domestic Violence Helpline Worker, Refuge, Central London, c£24,000 pa inc.
ILW
Paediatric Project Officer - London, Contact a Family, London EC1, NJC 26-28
£22,638 - £23,958 including ILW for 35 hours per week
Project Worker, EDEN BROWN (agy), London, £24 000 + bens
Project Workers, Addaction, Hastings, East Sussex, £18,200 pa

CAMPAIGNING
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=3

Campaigns and Parliamentary Assistant, FLOW CARITAS Medical Charity, London,
£19,750 - £20,600

CHRISTIAN
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=4

Cathedral Development Manager, Coventry Cathedral, Coventry, Paid
Events Manager & Press Officer, Coventry Cathedral, Coventry, Paid
Faithworks Administrative Assistant, Oasis Trust, London SE1, Paid
Life Skills Manager, Acorn Christian Ministries, Chesterfield, £23,000
Regional Volunteer Manager for Ireland, Tearfund, Belfast, Between £25,390
and £25,890 p.a. + car
Senior Income Processing Officer, Tearfund, Teddington, between £19,361 and
£19,861 p.a.
Supporter Records Co-ordinator, Oasis Trust, London SE1, Paid

COMMUNICATIONS/PR
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=5

Acquisition Co-ordinator, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London, £21,000
Content Officer, Charity Action Recruitment, London, SE1, £20,000 +
Fundraising & Marketing opportunities, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Arts
Opportunities!, London
Fundraising, Press, PR and Marketing, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Charity
opportunities!!!, London
Fundraising/Marketing Manager, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, South
Africa, Locally equivalent
Head Marketing and Communications, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London,
£28,863 - 32,790
Head of Communications and Marketing, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Highly
regarded not for profit organisation, London, £28,000 - £32,000
Individual Giving Manager, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Children's Disability Charity,
London, £36,675 -£39,846
Media and Communications Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTENRSHIP, Maternity cover
for 6-8 months starting Mid December, London, £27,000 - £29,000
Part Time Press & PR Officer, Adept Recruitment, Berkshire, £20,000 -
£22,000
PR and Events Officer, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Disability Charity, South London,
£22,100
Press and PR Volunteer, I CAN, EC1N 2QP
Public Relations Director, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Raising the standards
of animal welfare throughout the world., London, £32,000
Public Relations Director, FLOW CARITAS Animal Protection Charity, London,
c32,000
Senior Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Work for the largest UK charity,
London, £35,000
Senior Press and Public Relations Officer, Parenting Charity, North London,
£22,096 to £31,106
Senior Press Officer - HH/SH/4443, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT -
SOCIAL WELFARE, London, N1, £28,000
Senior Public Relations Officer, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, South London
Childrens Charity, London, £25,000 - £28,000
Website and Magazine Editor, FLOW CARITAS Animal Welfare Charity, London,
£22,936 - £24,333 pro rata + London Weighting

FINANCE
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=6

Accountant, The Principle Partnership, London, £20,000 - £25,000
Accounting Systems Adviser, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, Tanzania,
Locally equivalent
Business Accountant, The Principle Partnership, London, £26,000 - £32,000
Director of Finance and Administration, InKinddirect, London, City, c.£45000
Finance & Procurement Manager, Badenoch & Clark (agency), London SW,
c.£50,000
Finance Assistant, The Principle Partnership, London, £18,000 - £21,000
Finance Assistant - Credit Control, Badenoch & Clark, Kingston, £17000 -
24000
Finance Co-ordinator (Expenditure) to start ASAP., The Principle
Partnership, Central London, £20,000 - £21,000
Finance Manager, The Principle Partnership, London, £25,000
Finance Officer, The Principle Partnership, London, £16,000 - £18,000
Finance Officer, The Principle Partnership, London, £20,000 - £21,000
Finance Officer, The Principle Partnership, London, £20,000 - £22,000
Finance Officer - 1 day per week, The Principle Partnership, London,
£20,000 - £21,000
Financial & Business Adviser, VSO, Cambodia, Locally equivalent
Financial Controller - HH/SH/4444, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT -
HEALTH, London, N1, £25k - £27k
Interim Head of Finance - Part Time, Hilton in the Community Foundation,
London-Holland Park, £40000 pro-rata
Internal Auditor, The Principle Partnership, London, £24,000 - £27,000
Management Accountant, The Principle Partnership, London, £24,000 - £27,000
Management Accountant, The Principle Partnership, London, £25,000 - £28,000
Management Accountant, The Principle Partnership, London, £35,000 - £37,000
Purchase Ledger Assistant, The Principle Partnership, London, £18,000 -
£20,000
Purchase Ledger Assistant, The Principle Partnership, London, £18,000 -
£20,000
Purchase Ledger Clerk, The Principle Partnership, London, £17,000 - £20,000
Senior Income Processing Officer, Tearfund, Teddington, between £19,361 and
£19,861 p.a.

FUNDRAISING
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=7

Account Executive, Adept Recruitment, London, £21,000 - £23,000
Account Manager - Partnership Development, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP,
Children's Charity, London, £28,000 - £29,000
Accounting Systems Adviser, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, Tanzania,
Locally equivalent
Acquisition Co-ordinator, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London, £21,000
Appeal Director (Trust) 6 month contract, Mental Health and Social Welfare,
Midlands, Shropshire or Surrey, £28,000
Area Fundraising Manager - Staffordshire, Warwickshire and West Midlands,
British Red Cross, Birmingham, £21,000 - £23,000 per annum
Community Fundraising Co-ordinator, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, A great first
step into fundraising!, London, £17,000
Community Fundraising Manager, Disability Charity, Manchester / Cheshire -
flexibility, £22,896 - £24,357
Community Fundraising Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Disability Charity
based in Stockport, Stockport, £22,000 - £24,000
Community Fundraising Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Disability Charity
based in Stockport, Stockport, £22,000 - £24,000
Corporate Account Executive, Badenoch & Clark (agency), London N1, £22,699
Corporate Account Manager, FLOW CARITAS Children's Medical Charity, London,
£24,000
Corporate and Trust Fundraising Manager, FLOW CARITAS Children's Medical
Charity, London, £27,000
Corporate Development Executive, FLOW CARITAS Youth Charity, London, £25,000
Corporate Development Manager, FLOW CARITAS Youth Charity, London, £30,000
Corporate Devleopment Manager, Environmental, Surrey, c £26,500
Corporate Fundraising Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Expanding
Children's Charity, London, £25,000 - £30,000
Corporate Fundraising Manager (North Region), THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, An
exciting opportunity to work for this National Youth charity, Manchester,
£24,000 - £25,000
Corporate Manager, Eden Brown (AGY), Central London, £28, 000
Corporate Partnerships Developer, Adept Recruitment, London, £27,500
Corporate Partnerships Developer HH/SH/4450, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY
RECRUITMENT - HEALTH, London, WC1B, £28k
Corporate Partnerships Fundraising Manager, EDEN BROWN (agy), London, up to
£29550
Corporate Partnerships Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Exciting new
position in women's health charity, London, £26,500
Database Manager, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London, up to £28,000
DEPUTY AREA FUNDRAISING CO-ORDINATOR, East Anglian Air Ambulance, North and
East Norfolk, Breckland and Norwich, £14,000-16,000 pro rata
Development Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Fantastic opportunity in the
Arts!, London, £30,000 - £40,000
Development Manager, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Arts Organisation, London, £35,000
Development Officer, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Dynamic Performing Arts
organisation, London, £20,000 - £22,000
Director of Fundraising and Communications, Medair, London SW1, Not
Specified
Donor Development & Database Manager, Momentum, Glasgow, £19000 - £23000
Donor Development Co-ordinator, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London, circa
£21,000
Donor Development Coordinator, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Leading Cultural
Museum, London, £20,000 - £23,000
Donor Development Officer, Charity Action Recruitment, Kent, TN16, £22,000 -
£24,000
Event Project Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Immediate contract until
April 2005, London, £26,000 - £30,000
Events Co-ordinator, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, A fantastic opportunity to
join this highly regarded health charity!, London, £20,394
Fundraiser, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, Ghana, Locally equivalent
Fundraiser, Harris Hill - Charity Recruitment - Arts, London, £20,000 -
£25,000 pro rata
Fundraiser, Adept Recruitment, London, £32,000
Fundraising Manager, Eden Brown (AGY), London - N9, £25,000
Fundraising & Marketing opportunities, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Arts
Opportunities!, London
Fundraising Administrator - HH/SH/4454, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT -
HEALTH, Twickenham, £22,000
Fundraising and Development Officer, Access Committee for Birmingham,
Birmingham, £24,000 to 29,000
Fundraising Campaigns Co-ordinator, FLOW CARITAS Medical Charity, London,
£18,000 - £23,000
Fundraising Campaigns Coordinator, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, International
Medical Charity, London, £18,000 - £23,000
Fundraising Director, THE PRINICIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Twelve month contract
starting Mid February, London, £38,000 - £40,000
Fundraising Manager, Hospice, London (SW), circa £36,000 per annum
Fundraising Manager, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London, circa £36,000
Fundraising Manager, Hospice, London - SW, circa £36,000
Fundraising Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Leading Cultural Museum,
London, £30,000 - £40,000
Fundraising Manager, Adept Recruitment, London, £25,000 - £30,000
Fundraising Manager, FLOW CARITAS Medical Charity, London, c£36,000
Fundraising Manager, FLOW CARITAS Youth Music Charity, London, £26,000 -
£30,000 pro rata
Fundraising Manager (with Major Donor exp), Health Charity, London, circa
£36,000
Fundraising Officer, RedR-IHE, London SW1P 3AA, c£18,000 - £22,000 depending
on competence and experience
Fundraising Officer, Disability Charity, Bristol, circa £20,000 - £24,000
Fundraising, Press, PR and Marketing, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Charity
opportunities!!!, London
Fundraising/Marketing Manager, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, South
Africa, Locally equivalent
Grants Fundraiser, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Exciting Youth Music Charity,
London, £26,000
Head Marketing and Communications, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London,
£28,863 - 32,790
Head of Corporate and Trusts, Eden Brown (AGY), Kingston, 31,000 - 35,000
Head of Corporate Development, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Established
Performing Arts Centre, London, £30,000 - £35,000
Head of Development, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Theatre - Recruiting Now!!,
London, £27,000 - £29,000
Head of Development, Execucare, London, £35,000 to £45,000
Head of Direct Marketing, Execucare, London, up to £40,000
Head of Fundraising, Adept Recruitment, London, £31,000 - £35,000
Head of Fundraising, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP - Bringing life skills to
young people!, London, £30,000 - £35,000
Head of Fundraising, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, An exciting opportunity to
work for this health charity, London, £35,000
Head of Fundraising, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Arts Organisation, London, £40 -
45,000
Head of Fundraising, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Prestigious Arts
Organisation, London, £40,000 - £45,000
Head of Income Generation, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Christian Campaigning
Charity, London, £30,000
Head of Marketing and Fundraising, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Working for
empowerment and choice for disabled people., London, £35,000
Income Generation Manager, Environmental, London, £29,377 - £35,290
Income Generation Manager, Environmental Charity, London, £29377 -£35290
plus £4484 London Weighting
Individual Giving & Membership Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Exciting
Performing Arts venue, London, £23,000 - £26,000
Individual Giving Manager, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Children's Disability Charity,
London, £36,675 -£39,846
Individual Giving Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, National Disability
Charity, London, £36,000 -£39,000
Lottery Officer, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, National Disability Charity,
London, £21,000 - £22,000
Major Donors Officer - HH/KL/4457, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT -
HUMANITARIAN, London, £24,000
Major Grants Fundraiser, EDEN BROWN - Environmental Charity, Devizes -
Wiltshire, £25,000 + Benefits
Marketing Professionals, Compton Associates, London
National Corporate Fundraising Manager, Social Issues, South West - Poole or
London WC2N, £27,800 - £45,800 (Initially at the bottom end)
National Corporate Fundraising Manager, Social Issues, South West - Poole or
London WC2N, £27,800 - £45,800 (Initially at the bottom end)
National Statutory Fundraiser, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Community focused
Children's Charity, London, £22,000 - £25,000
Personal Interactive Fundraisers, FLOW CARITAS Various Charities, London,
£7.50 - £9.50 per hour
PR and Events Officer, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Disability Charity, South London,
£22,100
Programme Fundraising Officer, Disability Charity, Brockley (Bristol),
£20,733 to £24,000
Programme Fundraising Officer - HH/KL/4440, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY
RECRUITMENT - DISABILITY, Bristol, £20733 - £24000
Public Events Co-ordinator, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Exciting new
opportunity within a thriving Cultural London Centre..., London, £25,000 -
£27,000
Regional Fundraising Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Home based role -
Midlands, London, £25,000
Regional Fundraising Manger - North East Region, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP,
Home Based role, North East, £25,000
Regional Manager- Birmingham, Adept Recruitment, Birmingham, £25,000
Regional Manager- North East, Adept Recruitment, North East, £25,000
Regional Statutory Fundraiser, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Community focused
Children's Charity - possibly part time/home based, London, £20,000 -
£21,000
Regional Trusts Fundraiser, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Community focused
Children's Charity - possibly part time/home based, London, £20,000 -
£21,000
Senior Account Director - One to One Fundraising - HH/KL/3865, HARRIS HILL -
CHARITY RECRUITMENT - CHILDREN'S, London, £30 - 34K
Senior Corporate Account Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP - National
disability charity, London, £27,000 - £28,000
Senior Database Marketing Assistant, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London,
£21,900
Senior Fundraiser - Major Gifts, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Exciting
position for a female fundraiser, London, £28,000 - £30,000
Senior Major Giving Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Looking for your
next challenge? A great opportunity to work for this high profile Health
charity!, London, £30,000 - £33,000
Senior Trust Fundraiser, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Established Housing
Charity, London, £30,000 - £32,000
Snr Trust Fundraiser, National Social Welfare Charity, London, circa £32,000
Special Gifts Officer, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, National Cancer Charity,
London, £24,000 - £26,000
Statutory and Trust Fundraiser, EDEN BROWN - (Agy), London, £25,000
Statutory Fundraiser, Adept Recruitment, London, £25,000
Trust and Corporate Fundraising Assistant - HH/KL/4439, HARRIS HILL -
CHARITY RECRUITMENT - DISABILITY, Bristol, £17828 - 21000
Trust Fundraiser, Adept Recruitment, London, £18,000 - £21,000
Trust Fundraiser, Adept Recruitment, London, £20,334
Trust Fundraiser, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London, £28,000 - £30,000
Trust Fundraiser, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, National Mental Health Care
Charity, London, £25,000
Trust Fundraiser, FLOW CARITAS Humanitarian Issues Charity, London, c£26,000
Trust Fundraising Officer, Badenoch & Clark (agency), London, £28,000
Trust Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, International Health Organisation,
London, £26,000
Trusts & Corporate Fundraising Officer, Disability Charity, Brockley
(Bristol), £17,828 to £21,000
Trusts & Foundations Manager, Adept Recruitment, Home Based with Regular
Office Visits, £22,000 - £25,000
Trusts Fundraiser, Human Rights Charity, London - Kings Cross, £23,000 -
£25,000
Trusts Manager, Mental Health and Social Welfare, Surrey, £27,000 - £28,000
pa
Wills and Legacies Professional, The Dewan Foundation, Harrow, Not Specified


GENERAL
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=11

Corporate Procurement Officer, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT, London,
£22,638 - £25,238
Events Manager & Press Officer, Coventry Cathedral, Coventry, Paid
Parentalk Events Coordinator, PARENTALK, London SE1, 21,000 pro rata
Project Coordinator, Sudan Organisation Against Torture (SOAT), London, NW6,
£18,000 per annum
Subject Officer, Music, Art and Design, Eden Brown, Central London, £19000
per annum
Team Officer, Arts and Humanities, Eden Brown, Central London, £19000 per
annum

HUMAN RESOURCES
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=8

Contract Manager (Gateshead), Health Organisation, Gateshead, £25,290 -
£33,032
Health & Safety Officer, Charity Action Recruitment, North London,
£18,000-21,000
HR Adviser (Recruitment / Compel), THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, National
Medical/ Care Charity, London EC1, £24,000 - £26,000
HR Director 1 year contract, The Principle Partnership, Central London,
circa £55,000
HR Manager, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, Education Establishment, Essex,
£34,000 - £36,000
Human Resource Advisor, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT, London, £24,222 -
£26,000

INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=9

Administrator (part-time), Medair, London SW1, Not Specified
Agriculturalist, GOAL, Lulingu, South Kivu Province, Democratic Republic of
Congo.
Assistant Country Director, GOAL, Democratic Republic of Congo
Business Advisor, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, Kenya, Locally
equivalent
Community Work Programme Manager, GOAL, Jebel Mara, Darfur
Country Director, GOAL, Luanda, Angola
Country Director, GOAL, Khartoum, Sudan
Country Director, GOAL, Zimbabwe
Deputy Director, GOAL Angola, GOAL, Angola
Direct Marketing Officer, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT - INTERNATIONAL,
London N1, £22,457
Direct Marketing Officer (Legacies), Charity Action Recruitment, London,
£26,457 per annum
Field Accountant, GOAL, Kutum, North Darfur, Sudan
Field Logistician, GOAL, Manono, Katanga Province
Financial & Business Adviser, VSO, Cambodia, Locally equivalent
Fundraiser, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, Ghana, Locally equivalent
HIV/AIDS TECHNICAL ADVISOR, GOAL, Inhambane, Mozambique
Humanitarian Officer - Institutional Funding, CAFOD, London SW9, £26,457 -
£29,107 pa
Informal Education Programme Coordinator, GOAL, Based in Khartoum, Sudan and
Naoribi, Kenya but will require travel to all programme locations.
Institutional Development Advisor (IDA, GOAL, Luanda with travel to the
provincial regions
Management Adviser, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, Nepal, Locally
equivalent
Medical Co-ordinator (provincial), GOAL, Democratic Repubic of Congo -
Manono, Katanga Province.
Medical Coordinator, GOAL, Kutum, North Darfur, Sudan
Medical Coordinator, GOAL, Khartoum
National Coordinator, Medair, London SW1, Not specified
NORTH WALES CO-ORDINATOR, CAFOD, London SW9, £19,674 to £21,999 pa
Organisational Development/Networking Adviser, VSO - Voluntary Services
Overseas, Tanzania, Locally equivalent
Programme Support Manager - Afghanistan, Tearfund, Kabul, Afghanistan,
Competitive salary and benefits package
Project Coordinator, Tropical Health and Education Trust, London NW1,
£17,000 p.a.
Provincial Coordinator, GOAL, Mozambique (Inhambane)
Regional Director, Middle East and North Africa, Penal Reform International,
Beirut, Lebanon, USD 30,000
Regional Director, South Asia, Penal Reform International, Kathmandu, Nepal,
£ 24,000
Strategy/Management Adviser, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, Bangladesh,
Locally equivalent

IT
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=10

Database Manager, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London, up to £28,000
Database Operations Executive, Save the Children, London EC1, £26,961

MANAGEMENT
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=40

Director of Finance and Administration, InKinddirect , London, City,
c.£45000
Cathedral Development Manager, Coventry Cathedral, Coventry, Paid
Children Young People and Families - Programme Head, FLOW CARITAS Health
Charity, London, £35,000
Life Skills Manager, Acorn Christian Ministries, Chesterfield, £23,000
North of England Manager, Contact a Family, North England, NJC 35-37
£25,938-£27,372 for 35 hours per week
Office Manager, Healthlink, London EC2A, £21,378 to £23,753
Project Coordinator, Sudan Organisation Against Torture (SOAT), London, NW6,
£18,000 per annum

MARKETING
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=36

Account Manager, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT - SERVICE, London EC2A,
£23,000 - £25,000
Commercial Marketing Manager, THR PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP - High Profile
Children's Charity, London, £27,000
Direct Marketing Officer (Legacies), Charity Action Recruitment, London,
£26,457 per annum
Donor Development Co-ordinator, EDEN BROWN - (Agy) Charity, London, circa
£21,000
Donor Development Manager - HH/SH/4463, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT -
INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT, London, NW5, £26,000
Marketing Professionals, Compton Associates, London
Senior Account Director - One to One Fundraising - HH/KL/3865, HARRIS HILL -
CHARITY RECRUITMENT - CHILDREN'S, London, £30 - 34K
Senior Marketing Executive, THE PRINCIPLE PARTNERSHIP, High Profile
Children's Charity, London, £23,000

POLICY/RESEARCH
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=12

Regional Development Manager, Social Issue, Bristol, £23,779 - £28,421
Research & Website Intern, Campaign Against Arms Trade, London N4, £14,175

SENIOR MANAGEMENT
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=13

Business Advisor, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, Kenya, Locally
equivalent
Business Support Director, Apex Leicester Project Ltd, Leicester, According
to experience
Director of Fundraising and Communications, Medair, London SW1, Not
Specified
Head of Communications, HARRIS HILL - CHARITY RECRUITMENT, London, £40,000
HR Director 1 year contract, The Principle Partnership, Central London,
circa £55,000
Management Adviser, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, Nepal, Locally
equivalent
Organisational Development/Networking Adviser, VSO - Voluntary Services
Overseas, Tanzania, Locally equivalent
Strategy/Management Adviser, VSO - Voluntary Services Overseas, Bangladesh,
Locally equivalent

SOCIAL CARE/DEVELOPMENT
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=14

24/7 Sessional Staff, ADDACTION, NEWCASTLE, £8.76 per hour
Care Services Manager, Heritage Care, London / Home based, £30,611 - £32,939
pa plus £1,732 pa London Allowance
Domestic Violence Helpline Worker, Refuge, Central London, c£24,000 pa inc.
ILW
Enabler, Henshaws Society For Blind People, Wakefield, £7,475 for a 25 hour
week (3 year fixed contract)
Full time 24/7 Project Workers, ADDACTION, Newcastle, up to £22,400
Lewisham Play Inclusion Project Worker, Contact a Family, London SE4, NJC
26-28 £22,638-£23,958 actual salary £5,659.30-£5,989.50 3 month contract
with possibility of extension (maternity cover) for 35 hours per week
starting February 2005
North of England Manager, Contact a Family, North England, NJC 35-37
£25,938-£27,372 for 35 hours per week
Paediatric Project Officer - London, Contact a Family, London EC1, NJC 26-28
£22,638 - £23,958 including ILW for 35 hours per week
Project Co-ordinator, Henshaws Society for Blind People, Wakefield, £16,725
per annum (3 year fixed contract)
Project Support/Development/Education, Bradford Nightstop, Bradford, 16,968
to 19,092
Project Worker, EDEN BROWN (agy), London, £24 000 + bens
Project Workers, Addaction, Hastings, East Sussex, £18,200 pa
PROJECT WORKERS X 2, ADDACTION, NEWCASTLE, UP TO £21,700
Regional Project Manager - West Midlands Home Based, EDEN BROWN - (Agy)
Charity, West Midlands - Home Based, £20,000
Rehabilitation Officer, Henshaws Society for Blind People, Wakefield, From
£17,890 per annum (3 year fixed contract)

TEMP
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=17

Event co-ordinator, British Association for Local History, work at home

TRAINING
www.charityjob.co.uk/category.asp?Category=15

Trainer, Depaul Trust, London NW10, £22,638 pa inclusive of London Weighting
Training Officer, Eden Brown, London W1, Circa £30,000
Your Turn Programme Director, Common Purpose UK, London EC1, £22,000 -
£25,000 pa

Nick
Fiona
2004-12-11 23:41:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
The real problem is that people don't follow the mitzvah to judge people
equally regardless of their wealth.
The discussion was about the pay for jobs in charities. I don't know about
the US but I do know about the UK. It is quite clear that one has to make a
considerable sacrifice to work for a charity.
No, Nick, it wasn't, it was specifically about the salaries of CEOs in
American Jewish NPOs.
Post by Nick
In the CharityJOB Weekly Digest that I receive weekly (see below) none of
the jobs advertised is at more than £40,000.
I appreciate Chief Executive and senior positions will be advertised
separately.
So why mention the previous paragraph?
Post by Nick
Below is the list of jobs advertised in CharityJOB this week and their rates
[excessive list that mentions neither Chief Executives nor Jewish charities
snipped]



Fiona
Nick
2004-12-14 14:27:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fiona
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
The real problem is that people don't follow the mitzvah to judge people
equally regardless of their wealth.
The discussion was about the pay for jobs in charities. I don't know about
the US but I do know about the UK. It is quite clear that one has to
make
Post by Fiona
a
Post by Nick
considerable sacrifice to work for a charity.
No, Nick, it wasn't, it was specifically about the salaries of CEOs in
American Jewish NPOs.
Post by Nick
In the CharityJOB Weekly Digest that I receive weekly (see below) none of
the jobs advertised is at more than £40,000.
I appreciate Chief Executive and senior positions will be advertised
separately.
So why mention the previous paragraph?
Post by Nick
Below is the list of jobs advertised in CharityJOB this week and their
rates
[excessive list that mentions neither Chief Executives nor Jewish charities
snipped]
Fiona
I am broadening the argument to the charity sector as a whole and to what
happens in other countries. You have the temerity to argue that I don't have
any evidence for what I say and then when I try to do that you have the gall
to say too much evidence and not relevant.

Clearly if Jewish CEO's in the USA are special and in a class of their own,
and they brook no comparison there is no way of saying whether their
remuneration is excessive or not.

If you were to bring in a firm of management consultants if this were their
brief I am sure that they would ask you to revise it.

I can't really win. I quote what happens in the UK charity sector by way of
comparison. I am honest enough to say that the list I provide might not
include the most senior jobs and they might be advertised elsewhere and I am
criticised on two counts.

I have never seen Fiona produce any external evidence to support her views,
yet where possible I do this.

Naturally Fiona is entitled to her views, although these seem to be mainly
picking holes in what ever anyone else says.

The only thing polite I can think of saying is "Get a life". Clearly her
response was a considered one because it was posted only 28 minutes after
mine. That is probably a shorter time than I took to put my posting
together.

Here are the compensation packages (the AIP's term) that we are talking
about for the heads of the 3 or 4 Jewish organisations. Despite Fiona's
objection to making external comparison there are 22 others in the list.

Stephen D. Solender, President Emeritus United Jewish Communities $1,068,924
Includes $694,212 in supplementary employee retirement plan benefits

(Lynn Taussig, President/CEO National Jewish Medical & Research Center
$617,595
I believe that this is only historically a Jewish organisation)

Rabbi Marvin Hier, Dean Simon Wiesenthal Center $482,528

Abraham H. Foxman, National Director Anti-Defamation League of B'nai B'rith
$458,320

I am aware that American society depends on volunteerism in a way that UK
society doesn't. Therefore these organisations Jewish or non-Jewish make a
contribution to American society in a way that few charities contribute to
UK society.

Jewish Care in the UK is in a similar position in that it does provide
services that in the state sector is already provided but it does provide a
parallel service for the Jewish community. I have been a user/recipient of
their services and they are amazing.

The largest old age home in the UK is Nightingale where I am a volunteer.

I don't apologise from drawing on my own knowledge, experience or research.
I live in the UK and therefore it is reasonable to draw on my knowledge of
the situation here.

After all it would be reasonable for American (the majority) posters to ask
me to shut up because I am a Brit and therefore what do I know about the USA
situation.

It is clear that you Americans are fascinated with an insight into the
British Jewish set-up and I welcome your contributions to our debate as I
hope you do vice versa.

Now, I better get on with the rest of my life!

Nick

PS A relative when I told him I was working to implement new Parliamentary
legislation in a public organisation. He proceeded to criticise the
legislation.

I was particularly hacked off because it was my nephew's barmitzvah and it
was neither the time nor the place.

I feel that she is an oppositionist. What does she find good about the
Jewish community other than herself?
Fiona
2004-12-14 17:56:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
The real problem is that people don't follow the mitzvah to judge
people equally regardless of their wealth.
The discussion was about the pay for jobs in charities. I don't know
about the US but I do know about the UK. It is quite clear that one
has to
Post by Nick
Post by Fiona
Post by Nick
make a considerable sacrifice to work for a charity.
No, Nick, it wasn't, it was specifically about the salaries of CEOs in
American Jewish NPOs.
Post by Nick
In the CharityJOB Weekly Digest that I receive weekly (see below) none
of the jobs advertised is at more than £40,000.
I appreciate Chief Executive and senior positions will be advertised
separately.
So why mention the previous paragraph?
Post by Nick
Below is the list of jobs advertised in CharityJOB this week and their
[excessive list that mentions neither Chief Executives nor Jewish
charities snipped]
I am broadening the argument to the charity sector as a whole and to what
happens in other countries. You have the temerity to argue that I don't have
any evidence for what I say and then when I try to do that you have the gall
to say too much evidence and not relevant.
Where exactly did I say above you have no evidence for what you say? You
presented evidence for a discussion that no one was having, I snipped your
"evidence" from *my* post because it was not relevant to what I was posting
about and I see no reason to waste bandwidth. It is still in your post for
anyone to respond to if they wish, hmmm, I wonder why no one has? Regardless
of whether you wanted to broaden the discussion or not, the discussion *was*
about CEOs and not about NPO staff salaries in general. And sad though it
may seem, your obvious efforts to collate masses of information were wasted.

Nick, I say this for your own sanity (if its not too late): on UseNet no has
to take you seriously; no one has to discuss anything with you, let alone
the topics you wish to discuss or the angle you want to approach them from.
If anyone takes you seriously you are lucky; if you get respect you are
lucky; if you even get a responce to a post you are lucky; no has an
obligation to be here, and everything is voluntary. So don't push it.


Fiona
Abe Kouris
2004-12-10 19:22:18 UTC
Permalink
"R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (£261,000 in real
money),
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they
head."

The President of the United States of America earns $400,000 per year.

Given that the United States of America is an organizaton a wee bit
larger (and more useful) than the ADL or the Siman Weiesnthal Center,
(and also given that I believe that the President is overpaid,
especially given the job performance of the ones who have served in my
lifetime) , I would consider Heir's and Foxman's salries excessive.
Eliyahu Rooff
2004-12-10 21:24:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Abe Kouris
"R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (£261,000 in real
money),
Post by Abe Kouris
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they
head."
Post by Abe Kouris
The President of the United States of America earns $400,000 per year.
Keep in mind that running for President isn't about money; it's
about power. The folks who get into office already have plenty of
the former and are looking for more of the latter. If it paid
minimum wage, they'd still run for office.

Eliyahu
Fiona
2004-12-12 00:39:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Abe Kouris
Post by Abe Kouris
"R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (£261,000 in real
money), that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations
they
Post by Abe Kouris
Post by Abe Kouris
head."
The President of the United States of America earns $400,000 per year.
Yeah, but look at the perks :-)



Fiona
b***@vms.huji.ac.il
2004-12-12 02:27:21 UTC
Permalink
"R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (=A3261,000 in real
money),
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they
head."
The President of the United States of America earns $400,000 per year.
Given that the United States of America is an organizaton a wee bit
larger (and more useful) than the ADL or the Siman Weiesnthal Center,
(and also given that I believe that the President is overpaid,
especially given the job performance of the ones who have served in my
lifetime) , I would consider Heir's and Foxman's salries excessive.
That reminds me of a quip supposedly told to Presdient Kenendy by
Israeli Prime Minister Ben Gurion: "You may be the president of 160 million
people but I'm the president of 5 million presidents" :-)

Josh
Nick
2004-12-12 16:00:36 UTC
Permalink
"Abe Kouris" <***@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:***@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
"R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (£261,000 in real
money),
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they
head."

The President of the United States of America earns $400,000 per year.

Given that the United States of America is an organizaton a wee bit
larger (and more useful) than the ADL or the Siman Weiesnthal Center,
(and also given that I believe that the President is overpaid,
especially given the job performance of the ones who have served in my
lifetime) , I would consider Heir's and Foxman's salries excessive.

Reply:

There appear to be some non sequiturs here.

Nick
Henry Goodman
2004-12-12 22:27:26 UTC
Permalink
"Abe Kouris" <***@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:***@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
"R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (£261,000 in real
money),
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they
head."

The President of the United States of America earns $400,000 per year.

Given that the United States of America is an organizaton a wee bit
larger (and more useful) than the ADL or the Siman Weiesnthal Center,
(and also given that I believe that the President is overpaid,
especially given the job performance of the ones who have served in my
lifetime) , I would consider Heir's and Foxman's salries excessive.


Perhaps if you paid more you would get better Presidents. Something
about peanuts and monkeys.
--
Henry Goodman
henry dot goodman at virgin dot net
Eliyahu Rooff
2004-12-13 05:17:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Abe Kouris
The President of the United States of America earns $400,000 per year.
Given that the United States of America is an organizaton a wee bit
larger (and more useful) than the ADL or the Siman Weiesnthal Center,
(and also given that I believe that the President is overpaid,
especially given the job performance of the ones who have served in my
lifetime) , I would consider Heir's and Foxman's salries excessive.
Post by Abe Kouris
Perhaps if you paid more you would get better Presidents. Something
about peanuts and monkeys.

As I mentioned elsewhere, most of our recent Presidents and presidential
candidates are already multimillionaires. It's not about money; it's
about power. They'd take the job if it were a non-paid position.

Eliyahu
Nick
2004-12-13 14:08:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Abe Kouris
Post by Abe Kouris
The President of the United States of America earns $400,000 per year.
Given that the United States of America is an organizaton a wee bit
larger (and more useful) than the ADL or the Siman Weiesnthal Center,
(and also given that I believe that the President is overpaid,
especially given the job performance of the ones who have served in my
lifetime) , I would consider Heir's and Foxman's salries excessive.
Post by Abe Kouris
Perhaps if you paid more you would get better Presidents. Something
about peanuts and monkeys.
As I mentioned elsewhere, most of our recent Presidents and presidential
candidates are already multimillionaires. It's not about money; it's
about power. They'd take the job if it were a non-paid position.
Eliyahu
I presume that they have no personal living expenses while they are in the
White House. Afterwards they can get a massive book deal and go on the
after-dinner circuit. I gather that Baroness Thatcher gets £30,000 per show.

Again I also presume that nobody would let a former President go without.

Nick
Art Werschulz
2004-12-13 23:20:38 UTC
Permalink
Hi.
Post by Abe Kouris
The President of the United States of America earns $400,000 per year.
Perhaps if you paid more you would get better Presidents.
Somehow, this reminded me of the following anecdote:

One year, baseball star Babe Ruth was demanding an $80,000/yr salary.
A reporter objected, since this was more than that of then-President
Herbert Hoover ($75,000/yr). Ruth reported replied:

"I know, but I had a better year than Hoover."
--
Art Werschulz (***@comcast.net)
207 Stoughton Ave Cranford NJ 07016
(908) 272-1146
Harry Weiss
2004-12-12 07:11:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
Rabbi Marvin Hier, Simon Wiesenthal Center
Abraham Foxman, ADL
R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (?261,000 in real money),
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they head.
Executive salaries for non-profit organisations have to be competative with
profit making organisations of comparable size and complexity if the NPOs
are to attract top calibre staff. You cannot expect people to risk the same
levels of stress and responsibility as commercial companies but for less
just because it's an NPO.
As for Solender, I'm not sure how to interpret the figures, over a million
may be excessive, but more than half of that is pension provision.
He heads the United Jewish communites, which is legally a non profit
organzation, but is barely one according to what I heard. They run
cemeteries and make their money from the services they deliver rather than
fund raising.

I can think of a few more that probably really pay more, but the
executives recieve perks rather than salaries. Those would include some
Kashrut agencies that are no communal, but non profits controlled by a
small number of individuals.
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
The mainline Catholic and Protestant agencies do not pay such salaries.
Why do the Jewish groups ?
What does it matter to us what the Xtians pay their staff?
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
This is not a new problem, but, as far as I know, it has not received
the attention it deserves.
Why is it a problem?
Fiona
--
Harry J. Weiss
***@panix.com
Paul S. Wolf
2004-12-12 16:32:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Harry Weiss
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
Rabbi Marvin Hier, Simon Wiesenthal Center
Abraham Foxman, ADL
R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (?261,000 in real money),
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they head.
Executive salaries for non-profit organisations have to be competative with
profit making organisations of comparable size and complexity if the NPOs
are to attract top calibre staff. You cannot expect people to risk the same
levels of stress and responsibility as commercial companies but for less
just because it's an NPO.
As for Solender, I'm not sure how to interpret the figures, over a million
may be excessive, but more than half of that is pension provision.
He heads the United Jewish communites, which is legally a non profit
organzation, but is barely one according to what I heard. They run
cemeteries and make their money from the services they deliver rather than
fund raising.
Harry, you've got the wrong organization in mind. UJC has nothing to do
with direct services such as running cemeteries. In fact, it has little
to do with direct fund raising either.

United Jewish Communities is the successor organization formed as a
result of a merger of the United Jewish Appeal, United Israel Appeal
and the Council of Jewish Federations. It has nothing to do with direct
services such as running cemeteries.

United Jewish Communities (UJC) represents 155 Jewish Federations and
400 independent communities across North America. THOSE groups do major
fund raising, of course, and in a few cases, may operate cemeteries for
the local Jewish communities. The UJC annually holds a meeting /
convention, called the "General Assembly" (GA). This year's GA was here
in Cleveland last month, and was attended by about 3500 participants. I
served as a volunteer during the meeting. Last year the GA was in
Israel, next year it will be in Toronto.

Howard Rieger is the current President and Chief Executive Officer. He
succeeded Steve Hoffman earlier this year, who had succeeded Solender 3
years ago.

See the following web site for more information: http://www.ujc.org/
--
Paul S. Wolf, P.E. mailto:***@alum.wpi.edu
Past President, Great Lakes Region, Federation of Jewish Men's Clubs
Harry Weiss
2004-12-12 19:36:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul S. Wolf
Post by Harry Weiss
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
Rabbi Marvin Hier, Simon Wiesenthal Center
Abraham Foxman, ADL
R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (?261,000 in real money),
that's not excessive in terms of the size of the organisations they head.
Executive salaries for non-profit organisations have to be competative with
profit making organisations of comparable size and complexity if the NPOs
are to attract top calibre staff. You cannot expect people to risk the same
levels of stress and responsibility as commercial companies but for less
just because it's an NPO.
As for Solender, I'm not sure how to interpret the figures, over a million
may be excessive, but more than half of that is pension provision.
He heads the United Jewish communites, which is legally a non profit
organzation, but is barely one according to what I heard. They run
cemeteries and make their money from the services they deliver rather than
fund raising.
Harry, you've got the wrong organization in mind. UJC has nothing to do
with direct services such as running cemeteries. In fact, it has little
to do with direct fund raising either.
United Jewish Communities is the successor organization formed as a
result of a merger of the United Jewish Appeal, United Israel Appeal
and the Council of Jewish Federations. It has nothing to do with direct
services such as running cemeteries.
You are right. I was thinking of United Hebrew Communities
Post by Paul S. Wolf
United Jewish Communities (UJC) represents 155 Jewish Federations and
400 independent communities across North America. THOSE groups do major
fund raising, of course, and in a few cases, may operate cemeteries for
the local Jewish communities. The UJC annually holds a meeting /
convention, called the "General Assembly" (GA). This year's GA was here
in Cleveland last month, and was attended by about 3500 participants. I
served as a volunteer during the meeting. Last year the GA was in
Israel, next year it will be in Toronto.
Howard Rieger is the current President and Chief Executive Officer. He
succeeded Steve Hoffman earlier this year, who had succeeded Solender 3
years ago.
One thing I noticed was that a significant amount was pension. It
could be a result of good investments in his 401K.
Post by Paul S. Wolf
See the following web site for more information: http://www.ujc.org/
--
Past President, Great Lakes Region, Federation of Jewish Men's Clubs
--
Harry J. Weiss
***@panix.com
Yisroel Markov
2004-12-13 21:35:38 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 19:36:34 +0000 (UTC), Harry Weiss
[snip]
Post by Harry Weiss
Post by Paul S. Wolf
Howard Rieger is the current President and Chief Executive Officer. He
succeeded Steve Hoffman earlier this year, who had succeeded Solender 3
years ago.
One thing I noticed was that a significant amount was pension. It
could be a result of good investments in his 401K.
Unlikely. Typically the amount disclosed is the amount contributed by
the employer to his pension plan (not a 401(k) - actually a 401(b) for
a non-profit), or deferred compensation.

Yisroel "Godwrestler Warriorson" Markov - Boston, MA Member
www.reason.com -- for unbiased analysis of the world DNRC
--------------------------------------------------------------------
"Judge, and be prepared to be judged" -- Ayn Rand
Asher N
2004-12-12 18:07:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Harry Weiss
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy.
I have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide
for a number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about
donating to the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
Rabbi Marvin Hier, Simon Wiesenthal Center
Abraham Foxman, ADL
R' Heir and Foxman both earn less than $500,000 (?261,000 in real
money), that's not excessive in terms of the size of the
organisations they head. Executive salaries for non-profit
organisations have to be competative with profit making organisations
of comparable size and complexity if the NPOs are to attract top
calibre staff. You cannot expect people to risk the same levels of
stress and responsibility as commercial companies but for less just
because it's an NPO.
As for Solender, I'm not sure how to interpret the figures, over a
million may be excessive, but more than half of that is pension
provision.
He heads the United Jewish communites, which is legally a non profit
organzation, but is barely one according to what I heard. They run
cemeteries and make their money from the services they deliver rather
than fund raising.
Non-profit does not equate to generating revenues through fund raising.
Susan Cohen
2004-12-09 19:57:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
[snip]
these
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
salaries place these functionaries in a realm of luxury that ordinary
people can only dream of.
The mainline Catholic and Protestant agencies do not pay such salaries.
Why do the Jewish groups ?
What you describe does not sound *nearly* as bad as charities in the US
where 1% goes to the charity, and the execs have multiple homes, etc. This
is (or was at the time I heard it reported) true of the Purple Heart &
Goodwill.

Susan
Abe Kouris
2004-12-10 19:07:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
These individuals receive far more in compensation than anyone I have
ever worked with in my life,
Median wages in the US were about $13/hour last time I looked. (that
would be about $27,000 a year)
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
more than anyone I have ever known (I
believe).
The mainline Catholic and Protestant agencies do not pay such
salaries.
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
Why do the Jewish groups ?
This is not a new problem, but, as far as I know, it has not received
the attention it deserves.
I was talking to someone who is on the rabbinic search committee at
their shul. The rabbinical organization they're dealing with more or
less expects "total compensation" (which means the actual cash salary
the rabbi gets is less) of more than $80,000 yr for a rabbi fresh out
of rabbinical school. Big-shot rabbis of large congregations get
$200,000 - $300,000 per year, which is one reason why I don't belong to
a large congregation.
Of course, the rest of the staff is treated like dirt.
Paul S. Wolf
2004-12-12 04:04:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
That data is obviously out of date.

Solender hasn't been at UJC for over 3 years. He was succeeded by Steven
Hoffman, President of the Cleveland Jewish Community Federation, who
served there for three years, and has returned to his position in Cleveland.
--
Paul S. Wolf, P.E. mailto:***@alum.wpi.edu
Past President, Great Lakes Region, Federation of Jewish Men's Clubs
Shlomo Chaim
2004-12-13 14:31:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul S. Wolf
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
That data is obviously out of date.
Solender hasn't been at UJC for over 3 years. He was succeeded by Steven
Hoffman, President of the Cleveland Jewish Community Federation, who
served there for three years, and has returned to his position in Cleveland.
--
Past President, Great Lakes Region, Federation of Jewish Men's Clubs
This is a serious accusation. Many people use the information from this site
to make important decisions and you say that the information is years out of
date. Years.

I took a quick look at the site and found this (which pretty much confirms
Paul's satement):

http://www.ujc.org/content_display.html?ArticleID=116716
Paul S. Wolf
2004-12-14 03:26:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Shlomo Chaim
Post by Paul S. Wolf
Post by w***@interchange.ubc.ca
http://www.charitywatch.org/criteria.html#top20
This link gives information from the latest Charity Rating Guide &
Watchdog Report of the AIP, the American Institute of Philanthropy. I
have been a subscriber to the hard copy edition of this guide for a
number of years. I find it excellent. I am happier about donating to
the AIP than I am to almost any other non-profit group.
In the current guide, there is information on the 25 highest paid
executives of American charities. Of these, four head Jewish groups.
Stephen Solender, United Jewish Communities
That data is obviously out of date.
Solender hasn't been at UJC for over 3 years. He was succeeded by Steven
Hoffman, President of the Cleveland Jewish Community Federation, who
served there for three years, and has returned to his position in Cleveland.
--
Past President, Great Lakes Region, Federation of Jewish Men's Clubs
This is a serious accusation. Many people use the information from this site
to make important decisions and you say that the information is years out of
date. Years.
I took a quick look at the site and found this (which pretty much confirms
http://www.ujc.org/content_display.html?ArticleID=116716
And even that is a year old, as it refers to LAST year's GA in Israel
(This year's was here in Cleveland last month). Steve Hoffman returned
to his prior position as President of the Cleveland Jewish Community
Federation (which employs both my wife and my son) a couple of months
ago. He had taken a leave of absence for three years to serve at the UJC.

I took another look at the original post. The web page in question
refers to Steve Solender as "President Emeritus" not President. But it
still doesn't say what year the data is for. The complete listing for
him shows:

Stephen D. Solender, President Emeritus
United Jewish Communities
$1,068,924
Includes $694,212 in supplementary employee retirement plan benefits

So his actual salary including expense account (which would include
multiple trips to Israel, I'd assume) was $374,712.
--
Paul S. Wolf, P.E. mailto:***@alum.wpi.edu
Past President, Great Lakes Region, Federation of Jewish Men's Clubs
Loading...